Bronco Safari 2024 permit denied

TechnicalDisaster

Was this a decision made at the Federal level in any way?

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/feds-closed-over-300-miles-off-road-trails-in-moab-utah-more-come/
😠

TechnicalDisaster

Was this a decision made at the Federal level in any way?

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/feds-closed-over-300-miles-off-road-trails-in-moab-utah-more-come/

Even though the town of Moab is not responsible, I think off-roaders should boycott Moab. If the business elements scream in pain, and draw attention to what the Feds are doing, maybe something might get done. My take is that an overly ideological, purist (puritanical?) element is ascendant in the environmental movement, a romantic longing to "re-wild" the land. This is the same thinking that wants to blow up dams in the west, which aggravates water shortages.

BostonBadlands

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/feds-closed-over-300-miles-off-road-trails-in-moab-utah-more-come/

That action doesn’t have anything to do with the county permit, which is the purpose of this thread. The same country that approved several other permits in the same meeting. You’re conflating two different issues.

Freedom, just a little piece at a time. Who needs it anyway? I do.

TechnicalDisaster

Was this a decision made at the Federal level in any way?

I believe it was a local decision regarding the Bronco Safari. The 300+ miles of trail closures that recently happened were I think BLM related. Like all good things, we are usually our own worst enemy. And if no one from our side knows about or cares to show up at public hearings, then only one side is voicing their opinions. We have to be extra vigilant regarding the stewardship of the trails. It doesn’t matter if we do 99 good things, the 1 bad thing is all they see. From what I understand, the local people who want to close all the trails to off road vehicles are very vocal and well organized. They are ready to pounce.

So maybe this was a local action. Big whoop. I have no doubt they are well connected with similarly minded people at the Federal level. And yes, @Tim Kiely, well organized--and well funded, by NGOs, foundations, think tanks, and tax dollars. They also want to drive live stock off federal lands (to reduce cow farts, you know) and introduce novel proteins(crickets, etc.) to our diet instead of meat.
Extremist environmentalism is their religion. When they talk about "depopulating the planet," it's you and me they have in mind.

Tricky Dick

I think it will depend on what everyone else wants to do.

imo, I think Bronco owners should try to respect their request to avoid Moab that week. But, understood if your group decides to go through with it.

BostonBadlands

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/feds-closed-over-300-miles-off-road-trails-in-moab-utah-more-come/

Even though the town of Moab is not responsible, I think off-roaders should boycott Moab. If the business elements scream in pain, and draw attention to what the Feds are doing, maybe something might get done. My take is that an overly ideological, purist (puritanical?) element is ascendant in the environmental movement, a romantic longing to "re-wild" the land. This is the same thinking that wants to blow up dams in the west, which aggravates water shortages.

A lot of the businesses in Moab donate to the "greenies" - like SUWA. So, when you are in Moab, do your research before dropping coin.

Deano Bronc

Just saw this on Facebook this morning.

I gave the 😍 reaction because of their $5k donation to BRC.

Darrel

A lot of the businesses in Moab donate to the "greenies" - like SUWA. So, when you are in Moab, do your research before dropping coin.

Here's how we get the enviro-radicals to open up the trails: put EV charging stations out on them!
Remember to wave 😜 when you drive by an EV Scout or Hummer or something plugged in to the charger.😖

TK1215

Read the same thing around midnight. What an official shame

When I did BOR last spring the possibility of road closures was talked about ALOT…

Unfortunately the areas are so fragile it takes just a few inconsiderate actions to expedite more trail closures…

BostonBadlands

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/feds-closed-over-300-miles-off-road-trails-in-moab-utah-more-come/

Even though the town of Moab is not responsible, I think off-roaders should boycott Moab. If the business elements scream in pain, and draw attention to what the Feds are doing, maybe something might get done. My take is that an overly ideological, purist (puritanical?) element is ascendant in the environmental movement, a romantic longing to "re-wild" the land. This is the same thinking that wants to blow up dams in the west, which aggravates water shortages.

Why would you punish the folks that had nothing to do with this. The business owners have always backed the off road folks. Instead get on the phone, by the hundreds and thousands and call you federal reps/senators and put pressure on them. Before I hear, "calls don't work", dial the phone first and then cry like a baby. If you call, the numbers grow, they work.

There is 2 things things,
1. Our intent to apply for a special event permit getting denied, which I'm happy to answer questions about why we are doing what we are doing.

2. The new BLM "Travel Plan" in the moab area, which according to a BRC post yesterday Nov 28th:
"We received word that the Department of Interior appeals board denied the petition to stay the trail closures in Moab. They also denied the petition to stay from the State of Utah. This means the trails are now officially closed, and we encourage everyone to no longer use closed trails. This doesn’t mean the fight is over.
Our appeal is still pending, and there is still a lot of work ahead. If we prevail in our appeal, the BLM will be required to reopen the closed routes. We will keep you updated on the progress of the appeal."

Thanks
Richard
President ~ Utah Bronco Club

So what was the final closed count in Moab?

MIGeezer

So what was the final closed count in Moab?

317 Miles of trails closed

Tricky Dick

There is still an appeal but it was a unanimous rejection by the county.

https://moabsunnews.com/2023/10/19/county-commission-october-17/

Appreciate you and Laura and others brining this issue up for all to learn about and discuss. I frequent Moab and Sand Hollow and other areas in Colo and have been following these issues for years. It is unfortunate that the few bad apples analogy is in full swing on this issue. Clearly some in the the Off road community are doing a good job of earning a bad reputation. I would argue that Large club or group events seem to be the best type of events to have. Yes, more vehicles on trail at once but much better managed and controlled. In my experiences it appears that more and more the SXS community is driving much more angst than the traditional Offroad vehicle groups and we are getting lumped together. I do (SXS as well) I think we need to add more good apples to our bunch who will be vocal, Volunteer to help and fight what is a self inflicted wound but tied to some very short sighted and narrow perspectives on trail use and offroad activities. Moab needs to be concerned as the ECONOMIC IMPACT to the town and business will be significant. I have been wheeling, biking, hiking, camping in MOAB and the surrounding areas for 30 years and watched the growth there. Biking and wheeling have been the foundation for that growth. Alienate those groups and watch what happens. If EVERYONE adopts an inclusive attitude, with some additional requirements and oversight along with some basic respect, we can all enjoy these trails and outdoors in our own ways. Let's push back and work together. I for one will do all I can as part of the off road community to help our cause.
Happy Wheeling to all !

We as a people are not great at using nature without damaging it, sometimes wantonly and irreparably…

I remember driving through Moab last spring and seeing (it seems) like there were more SxS’s and vehicle rental places than motel rooms… perhaps not conducive to great off-road etiquette and behavior… it’s much bigger than personal freedom…

"I recognize the right and duty of this generation to develop and use the natural resources of our land; but I do not recognize the right to waste them, or to rob, by wasteful use, the generations that come after us."
Teddy Roosevelt

Localrich

There is 2 things things,
1. Our intent to apply for a special event permit getting denied, which I'm happy to answer questions about why we are doing what we are doing.

I'm basing my comments off the information that no one from the Bronco Utah Club attended the permit hearing. I apologize in advance if my information is incorrect, and if so, you can disregard my comments.

But if you didn't have a representative at the permit hearing, here are my thoughts:

I think you made a mistake calling for attendees to release their reservations and skip the trip in order to "prove the economic impact" on having the permit denied. The businesses that serve the Moab area had nothing to do with your group skipping the hearing and discussing your solutions to the problems. The businesses that serve Moab have nothing to do with your choice to move the event elsewhere, rather than re-apply for the permit in your 30 day grace period. All other problematic permits were approved that day, because the applicant was in attendance to defend their application.

You are "taking your ball and going home," while also trying to force the businesses to make a stand in your place, when you chose to not defend yourselves. I think that's unfair and will cause you even more problems down the road. The committee members will certainly learn of your Facebook post (if they haven't already) and it will just reinforce their belief that you are difficult to work with. Just look at the comments that have been made in support of you. They're going to give the Bronco commnunity a black eye, which will make it harder for anyone to hold events in this area.

I kindly ask you to amend your statement and remove the collateral damage.

You will see more of this. Ford is part to blame, by bringing a s-load of people who would have never ventured off road, out into the wild.
The problem is the liberal elitists who don't want motorized recreation on public land and are even trying to regulate motor racing. You have to band together and get rid of the politicians that support their twisted beliefs.
Starting at the top.

TechnicalDisaster

I'm basing my comments off the information that no one from the Bronco Utah Club attended the permit hearing. I apologize in advance if my information is incorrect, and if so, you can disregard my comments.

But if you didn't have a representative at the permit hearing, here are my thoughts:

I think you made a mistake calling for attendees to release their reservations and skip the trip in order to "prove the economic impact" on having the permit denied. The businesses that serve the Moab area had nothing to do with your group skipping the hearing and discussing your solutions to the problems. The businesses that serve Moab have nothing to do with your choice to move the event elsewhere, rather than re-apply for the permit in your 30 day grace period. All other problematic permits were approved that day, because the applicant was in attendance to defend their application.

You are "taking your ball and going home," while also trying to force the businesses to make a stand in your place, when you chose to not defend yourselves. I think that's unfair and will cause you even more problems down the road. The committee members will certainly learn of your Facebook post (if they haven't already) and it will just reinforce their belief that you are difficult to work with. Just look at the comments that have been made in support of you. They're going to give the Bronco commnunity a black eye, which will make it harder for anyone to hold events in this area.

I kindly ask you to amend your statement and remove the collateral damage.

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I agree, if the info about Utah Bronco Club not attending the meeting is correct, then that's a problem. I would love to hear from them in that regard as well as in general what their communications with the County were in regards to the issues from last year's Bronco Safari.

Also, let's not conflate the issues here. One is a County issue (i.e. no permits for Bronco Safari) and the other is a BLM issue (i.e. 300+ miles of trail closures).

As for the trail closures, all of those are through environmentally sensitive areas and the BLM has warned off-roaders for YEARS that if they didn't play nice that BLM would close the trails. Well, guess what? Here we are. Now we have to play defense. I also noted that someone pointed out the SxSs and Bronco/Jeeps are lumped into the same category by the BLM in this regard. My experience with SxSs is pretty negative when it comes to trail etiquette etc. but that might just be me. It could be that there too a few bad apples have now ruined it for the whole bunch as well.