Stock vs lifted tie rod angle????

Tahotrvlr
Mar 28, 2023

Rank V

Mar 28, 2023

Here are pics of Front Bronco suspension geometry.

One stock (full droop) and the other lifted (under load…mid travel):

Notice the severe Tie rod arm angle change????

Question????
If you lift your Bronco wouldn’t it be a good idea to lower your steering rack.(to maintain the stock geometry???)

That way you could maybe maintain the stock Tie rod angle geometry…..and lessen that increased load on the Tie rod/arm and steering rack? (with the severe angle change)????


Maybe this could lessen the chance of tie-rod, axle, and steering box failure/damage.

Just a thought👍🏼😀👍🏼

Side note::: stock or lifted I’m a huge fan of the drivers side steering box plastic bushing made by my favorite Machine shop from Texas….Bronco Busters!!!!

All Bronco’s should have this modification…
IMO 👍🏼😀👍🏼
broncoCrzy, BuckYeah

Friendly Neighborhood Sasquatch

Mar 28, 2023

#1
This is mine with a 2” coilover lift. It doesn’t look all that dramatic. I added LevelUp sleeves anyway which are a whole lot less bulky and ugly than BroncBusters, and will still break before damaging the steering rack. I don’t expect problems with this geometry.

Attachments

broncoCrzy, Tahotrvlr

Built Mild

Mar 28, 2023

#2
I agree, @Tahotrvlr. The BroncBusters were the first sensible mod I purchased for my Bronco.
Sparkie, broncoCrzy

Rank V

Mar 28, 2023

#3
This is mine with a 2” coilover lift. It doesn’t look all that dramatic. I added LevelUp sleeves anyway which are a whole lot less bulky and ugly than BroncBusters, and will still break before damaging the steering rack. I don’t expect problems with this geometry.
Sulley…. Thanks for your pic!!!!
Your pic makes my tie-rod angle point even more clear…👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Thank you 😀

Friendly Neighborhood Sasquatch

Mar 28, 2023

#4
Curious, how did you get your angle so extreme? Big lift? Big tires?

Rank V

Mar 28, 2023

#5
Curious, how did you get your angle so extreme? Big lift? Big tires?
This is not my rig… this pic is from the Bronco Buster test rig … not sure on the lift change… I believe he runs 40’s…
Saw him at KOH…👍🏼
Really nice person.
Super high quality fully CNC machined parts!!
BuckYeah

Don’t let the Hard Days Win! TEAM JEFF

Mar 28, 2023

#6
I agree, @Tahotrvlr. The BroncBusters were the first sensible mod I purchased for my Bronco.
Curious as to the need for this on the stock (Sasquatch) Broncos…. Has this been a point of failure? Wouldn’t it be covered by Warranty?

Friendly Neighborhood Sasquatch

Mar 28, 2023

#7
Curious as to the need for this on the stock (Sasquatch) Broncos…. Has this been a point of failure? Wouldn’t it be covered by Warranty?
Generally, this is only needed with a change in suspension geometry. The Bronco Buster rig hopefully has a lot more reinforced than just the ties. He's likely to break the CV axles and more with that Frankenstein.
BuckYeah, Broncofly

Rank V

Mar 29, 2023

#8
Curious as to the need for this on the stock (Sasquatch) Broncos…. Has this been a point of failure? Wouldn’t it be covered by Warranty?
If you look at the Bronco Busters video explaining the whole Bronco steering rack and pinion steering box…. the drivers side is where the rack (rod that slides left/right) engages the pinion (steering wheel input)…

On the drivers side there is a glued in thrust mechanism… on the end is this very minimal centering plastic part…. Other than that…. There is nothing supporting steering rod connecting to the tie rod link….

What exists is a possibility of a large deflected load from a tie rod link with a severe angle (full droop and full bump) damaging your steering rack….
Stock or lifted… I believe Ford dropped the ball on this side of the steering box…. On the other side is the power system part of the steering system which is supported by very expensive and precise “ball screw” . Ball screws are used on CNC machinery… they can take an enormous side load…

So IMO I believe the passenger side can take more deflection… But a severe angled tie rod link would also destroy this … Stock geometry not so much..

Anyway…. As someone else pointed out beefing up the tie rods and tie rod links would only transfer the extreme load to destroy your streering rack and pinion system.

Anyway I highly recommend watching the bronco Buster video… time well spent!👍🏼😀

Attachments

Bluestreak57

Friendly Neighborhood Sasquatch

Mar 29, 2023

#9
You’re forgetting the tie rod is supposed to be a fuse. You don’t want to prevent it from breaking all-together or you just move the problem, and then of course pay more money for yet another BroncBuster product. I think a lot of what they say is good marketing.
broncoCrzy, Tahotrvlr

Rank V

Mar 29, 2023

#10
You’re forgetting the tie rod is supposed to be a fuse. You don’t want to prevent it from breaking all-together or you just move the problem, and then of course pay more money for yet another BroncBuster product. I think a lot of what they say is good marketing.

Which is why attempting to replicate the Stock geometry (by maybe purchasing a lift kit that includes parts to relocated the steering rack to maintain stock geometry) would be a proper lift kit and would be a formidable solution to avoid disaster.

Axles destroyed, steering box destroyed, not mention the steering tie rod link…. Thousands and thousands of dollars …all because you put a low budget lift on your Bronco. That did not reposition the steering rack…(with correct geometry).

Vaughn Gittin and Loren Healey’s video
Is a great source of lift kit decision making information.
broncoCrzy, Deano Bronc

Built Mild

Mar 29, 2023

#11
So my takeaway is I wasted my money buying the BroncBuster tie-rod reinforcements without buying several other parts beforehand. 😝

Rank V

Mar 29, 2023

#12
So my takeaway is I wasted my money buying the BroncBuster tie-rod reinforcements without buying several other parts beforehand. 😝
No the Bronco Buster bushing is worth doing… for sure. Along with the clamps is a great setup. (For the drivers side)

But it will not solve poorly thought out suspension geometry… from a bad lift kit.
BuckYeah

Built Mild

Mar 29, 2023

#13
No the Bronco Buster bushing is worth doing… for sure. Along with the clamps is a great setup.

Okay, I'll keep them, then. I still have to install them. Haven't felt the need to do so sooner because I haven't made plans to traverse any challenging terrain (yet). My only concern is if they rub on anything that would constrict full motion. But, I'm guessing those guys have already checked for that. I don't plan on changing any suspension items, so I think I'll be safe. (I hope so!) 😉
Deano Bronc, TK1215

Rank VI

Mar 29, 2023

#14
Couple of my own observations while reading this thread. The tie rod is not supposed to be a "fuse". That's ridiculous. All of the parts are supposed to remain intact and continue to work through all of the conditions in which they were designed to be used. If they break, it isn't because they were designed to fail. It is because the driver is using the vehicle outside the design parameters. If you're breaking parts, it's because you're driving the vehicle outside of how it was designed to perform, or it's a bad design.

Lowering anything puts it closer to the ground. That defeats the purpose of designing or modifying a vehicle for off road use. Obviously there are fewer options with a design like what you find on the Bronco, but to lower the rack for better angles is to put parts closer to the obstacles you're trying to clear.

If you want to put 35"+ tires on your rig, understand, the vehicle wasn't designed that way (yeah, I know there is a Sasquatch package). It is marketed that way. Stay with the stock height and stock tire sizes and you should be fine. Modify your vehicle to put additional stress on components and you break parts, not fuses, parts used outside of their design parameters. Your Bronco was not designed to run 35"+ tires in the rocks. It just wasn't.

To respond more directly to the OP. The Bronco shouldn't be lifted to increase the angles, but the steering rack also shouldn't be lowered. Increasing the angles puts way more stress on the components. Lowering the rack puts it closer to the rocks, mud, snow and road debris. If you're more concerned with big tires and lifts, realize you're likely to have more issues with your steering rack. If you lower it, you're more likely to have issues related to where it is now located, bracketry, those other stresses or potential damage caused by a new location.
Bronco 202?, BuckYeah

Rank V

Mar 29, 2023

#15
My point is to avoid extreme angles on your tie rod links…(don’t go outside the stock design parameters) which is what you get with a cheap lift kit.

I agree 100% on not going outside the boundaries of the stock suspension geometry… i.e. design parameters…

However…. Ford did get it wrong with the tiny piece of plastic to center the shaft on the Drivers side of the Steering rack… and I do wholeheartedly endorse the Bronco Buster Bushing…

Ford also, got it wrong hanging a hundred pound spare tire on an aluminum tailgate…
Over time on jarring roads/trails what could possibly go wrong with that?😝

I think people have to use common sense judgment… but keep in mind that even Ford makes compromises and makes mistakes.

If you take a look at Sulley’s proper coil over lift the steering aka tie rod link is at a nearly horizontal angle … I would imagine someone went to the trouble of maintaining the stock geometry…. Also, many lift kits move the steering rack… this is not some revelation….

I guess in a nutshell, as you have stated, if you deviate from the stock design parameters you will put additional stresses and break parts.
extra toasty, AcesandEights

Friendly Neighborhood Sasquatch

Apr 02, 2023

#16
My advice is a little simpler. If you’re planning to make extreme geometry changes and worried about breaking a tie rod or steering rack, buy a Jeep instead. IFS is not the type of suspension for you.
Tahotrvlr, Bronco 202?

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